Product:Word Ratio and General Word Count Query

@Sam: Wow, killer article! This must be the longest article on all Wizzley and Pagewizz!! Great!

That's what we observe on Pagewizz: less products on an article does not mean lower revenue, IF the content is well written and the product really matches. On the contrary: readers prefer informative articles, something they like and tweet about. Something they trust in. If they trust your content, they are more inclined in buying something you recommend. That's what really works well nowadays. Things have changed since Squidoo and HP started - but not necessarily to the worse. It's just different requirements on content.

Lol, I had to bother Chef Keem a lot for getting me new modules and still had to streamline the article, but it brings in traffic from a lot, really a lot of, related keywords and I know it will mature well- it is an evergreen topic people will be still interested in years ;-) SY

Sam: 09/24/2012 - 05:52 PM

---

 

ryank: 09/24/2012 - 05:44 PM

---

 

Sam: 09/24/2012 - 05:30 PM

---

Come on people, 100 words of genuine content is too much per product or ad? 100 words of useful, for the prospective buyer!, content everybody can do in a heart beat! Wanna look what 100 words look like? Here you go:

"One hundred word are barely enough to tell a reader what a product is all about, what different versions it come in, how they differ, what it can be used for, why it is better than other similar products on the market or why the reader should buy it in the first! Add to that your personal experience, or that of your family and friends, with 'product' and why you recommend it to your readers and you have written one hundred words in a heart beat! It ain't that difficult, this paragraph contains 104 words and I wrote it in two minutes or less!”

 

SY

Perhaps a better question is, how many words does a reader WANT to read about a slight variation of a rubik's cube? 

Put the product / product comparison as high on the page / article as possible, and then, for the inquisitive reader, and Google!, put the rest of the information below the fold. As for laptop sleeves / cases ect you can always go by function / design / art. Come on people we are speaking 100 words as a product review, wanna see one of my articles, that makes money? Hold your breath for a monster! http://wizzley.com/gemstone-meanings/ We need to up the game, not to lower it for the sake of all our income! SY

Well that is a monumental article (and of personal interest, I once explored the possibility of importing gemstones from China into the UK), and should probably be published as a Kindle book complete with affiliate links.....

..... but it is well worth me pointing out that the majority of my sales pages on this account would be compliant with a 100 word to 1 product ratio. Example: http://wizzley.com/best-iphone-4-alarm-clock-dock/

It is also worth me pointing out that yes, while you have probably the longest Wizz I will ever see, you also have articles which would not be compliant with a 100 word per product policy.

888 words, 13 products (68 per product):

http://wizzley.com/small-doghouse/

930 words, 11 products (84 per product)

http://wizzley.com/harry-potter-iphone-4-case/

759 words, 11 products (69 per product)

http://wizzley.com/dog-bathing-suits-bikini/

More relevant to the debate is a discussion as to whether or not an article can offer value with a text/product value of less than 100, rather than turning it into a competition for who has the longest bit of sales copy. Either it can have value, or it can't, if it can't then that's an admission that some of your own content does not hold value. 

As far as I can see, you are producing sales copy which doesn't meet Wizzley's desired criteria just like us others?  

You yourself will need to find an additional 416 words for your small doghouse article, 176 more words for your harry potter iphone 4 case article, and 341 more words about bikini's for dogs. 

Mike_W: 09/24/2012 - 05:48 PM

---

Just to stop this getting too one sided, I'm with Sam and am ok with steps that stop Wizzley getting too spammy. Maybe 100 words per product was a bit extreme, but I respect the steps being made to protect the quality of the site. I made the decision to invest some time here in the hope that it would be a powerful domain down the track due to the stricter guidelines.

There are some good authors and great content on Squidoo. However, personally, I think Squidoo looks like trash with the amount of products they're allowed on pages. It gets abused. I have no idea how that site isn't penalized for it.  It's like google is in love with Seth Godin or something.

I appreciate the statistics that Squidoo is thriving, but I just don't get it. I clicked on something that was ranked top the other day, and there was virtually no content on the page - only products.

You won't find disagreement here about the low quality of much Squidoo content. 

But the ultra-thin pages that you refer to bare little relevance to this debate when applied in context, because Wizzley already had a 50 word to 1 product minimum in place.

Squidoo has no such restriction.

The debate here is whether or not it is beneficial to increase the ratio from 50:1 to 100:1.

The page that you refer to with no content other than products is already impossible to achieve on Wizzley irrespective of whether or not they increase the ratio from 50:1 to 100:1. 

So if you support an increase from 50:1, but believe 100:1 to be "a bit extreme", then what do you believe the text to product ratio should be?

Sam is supporting a 100:1 ratio, and you agree with that, but also believe it to be extreme? That is either a contradiction or a paradox. 

The missing ingredient is not text - it is choice.

I had a long explanation, but there is some level of competition in this industry and I decided not to give that one away.

Common sense and an understanding of how one shops should point out why adding 50-100 words of fluff just to show a different ad module for red iphone 5 skin on an article about iphine 5 skins is not neccessary - the pictures and ads provide all the description necessary when offering red,blue, green,black, white choice options etc. Fluff text would be unwanted and unwarranted.

One description of form, utility, function and price is sufficient for the whole category of product

ryank: 09/24/2012 - 06:30 PM

---

 

Sam: 09/24/2012 - 05:52 PM

---

 

ryank: 09/24/2012 - 05:44 PM

---

 

Sam: 09/24/2012 - 05:30 PM

---

Come on people, 100 words of genuine content is too much per product or ad? 100 words of useful, for the prospective buyer!, content everybody can do in a heart beat! Wanna look what 100 words look like? Here you go:

"One hundred word are barely enough to tell a reader what a product is all about, what different versions it come in, how they differ, what it can be used for, why it is better than other similar products on the market or why the reader should buy it in the first! Add to that your personal experience, or that of your family and friends, with 'product' and why you recommend it to your readers and you have written one hundred words in a heart beat! It ain't that difficult, this paragraph contains 104 words and I wrote it in two minutes or less!”

 

SY

Perhaps a better question is, how many words does a reader WANT to read about a slight variation of a rubik's cube? 

Put the product / product comparison as high on the page / article as possible, and then, for the inquisitive reader, and Google!, put the rest of the information below the fold. As for laptop sleeves / cases ect you can always go by function / design / art. Come on people we are speaking 100 words as a product review, wanna see one of my articles, that makes money? Hold your breath for a monster! http://wizzley.com/gemstone-meanings/ We need to up the game, not to lower it for the sake of all our income! SY

 

Well that is a monumental article (and of personal interest, I once explored the possibility of importing gemstones from China into the UK), and should probably be published as a Kindle book complete with affiliate links.....

..... but it is well worth me pointing out that the majority of my sales pages on this account would be compliant with a 100 word to 1 product ratio. Example: http://wizzley.com/best-iphone-4-alarm-clock-dock/

It is also worth me pointing out that yes, while you have probably the longest Wizz I will ever see, you also have articles which would not be compliant with a 100 word per product policy.

888 words, 13 products (68 per product):

http://wizzley.com/small-doghouse/

930 words, 11 products (84 per product)

http://wizzley.com/harry-potter-iphone-4-case/

759 words, 11 products (69 per product)

http://wizzley.com/dog-bathing-suits-bikini/

More relevant to the debate is a discussion as to whether or not an article can offer value with a text/product value of less than 100, rather than turning it into a competition for who has the longest bit of sales copy. Either it can have value, or it can't, if it can't then that's an admission that some of your own content does not hold value. 

As far as I can see, you are producing sales copy which doesn't meet Wizzley's desired criteria just like us others?  

You yourself will need to find an additional 416 words for your small doghouse article, 176 more words for your harry potter iphone 4 case article, and 341 more words about bikini's for dogs. 

 

Lol, I never said I am perfect, didn't I? But as that is a future requirement / requirement for my future articles I am perfectly happy to adhere to that. People, don't let us forget things like this adhere to articles yet to be published NOT adding to our work load by re-doing / editing existing articles!

It really does seem that the solution here would be to put sales pages on a subdomain if Wizzley are concerned about the possibility of the sales pages bringing down high quality informational or commentary articles.

I'm pretty confident that the subdomain would do just as well, if not better, than the main site. 

It's exactly what hubpages should have done instead of driving away the breadwinners.

100 words per ad is/was a bit extreme, fair enough.

To prevent any misunderstanding: this is not about articles like "Doghouse" or "Harry Potter", although "Doghouse" would probably perform just as well with a shorter bottom Amazon module.

It's about keeping away spamy-type authors abusing websites like Wizzley - not talking about you.

Sam: 09/24/2012 - 07:09 PM

---

 

ryank: 09/24/2012 - 06:30 PM

---

 

Sam: 09/24/2012 - 05:52 PM

---

 

ryank: 09/24/2012 - 05:44 PM

---

 

Sam: 09/24/2012 - 05:30 PM

---

Come on people, 100 words of genuine content is too much per product or ad? 100 words of useful, for the prospective buyer!, content everybody can do in a heart beat! Wanna look what 100 words look like? Here you go:

"One hundred word are barely enough to tell a reader what a product is all about, what different versions it come in, how they differ, what it can be used for, why it is better than other similar products on the market or why the reader should buy it in the first! Add to that your personal experience, or that of your family and friends, with 'product' and why you recommend it to your readers and you have written one hundred words in a heart beat! It ain't that difficult, this paragraph contains 104 words and I wrote it in two minutes or less!”

 

SY

Perhaps a better question is, how many words does a reader WANT to read about a slight variation of a rubik's cube? 

Put the product / product comparison as high on the page / article as possible, and then, for the inquisitive reader, and Google!, put the rest of the information below the fold. As for laptop sleeves / cases ect you can always go by function / design / art. Come on people we are speaking 100 words as a product review, wanna see one of my articles, that makes money? Hold your breath for a monster! http://wizzley.com/gemstone-meanings/ We need to up the game, not to lower it for the sake of all our income! SY

 

Well that is a monumental article (and of personal interest, I once explored the possibility of importing gemstones from China into the UK), and should probably be published as a Kindle book complete with affiliate links.....

..... but it is well worth me pointing out that the majority of my sales pages on this account would be compliant with a 100 word to 1 product ratio. Example: http://wizzley.com/best-iphone-4-alarm-clock-dock/

It is also worth me pointing out that yes, while you have probably the longest Wizz I will ever see, you also have articles which would not be compliant with a 100 word per product policy.

888 words, 13 products (68 per product):

http://wizzley.com/small-doghouse/

930 words, 11 products (84 per product)

http://wizzley.com/harry-potter-iphone-4-case/

759 words, 11 products (69 per product)

http://wizzley.com/dog-bathing-suits-bikini/

More relevant to the debate is a discussion as to whether or not an article can offer value with a text/product value of less than 100, rather than turning it into a competition for who has the longest bit of sales copy. Either it can have value, or it can't, if it can't then that's an admission that some of your own content does not hold value. 

As far as I can see, you are producing sales copy which doesn't meet Wizzley's desired criteria just like us others?  

You yourself will need to find an additional 416 words for your small doghouse article, 176 more words for your harry potter iphone 4 case article, and 341 more words about bikini's for dogs. 

 

Lol, I never said I am perfect, didn't I? But as that is a future requirement / requirement for my future articles I am perfectly happy to adhere to that. People, don't let us forget things like this adhere to articles yet to be published NOT adding to our work load by re-doing / editing existing articles!

And I never said that you weren't perfect, your not though, nobody is :P

Have you ever seen how much choice Amazon customers have when they hit the site? http://www.amazon.com/Cooler-Master-NotePal-Cooling-R9-NBC-4WAK-GP/dp/B002MU1ZRS/ref=sr_1_cc_1?s=aps&ie=UTF8&qid=1348528306&sr=1-1-catcorr&keywords=laptop+cooler

Like SF said.... choice.

You put 10 images of dresses for sale on a page and there is a 10 times greater chance that a woman will like at least one dress than there is on a page showing 1 dress. 

That's just logical. 

This conversation is starting to get a bit tedious, but I think the bottom line is that if you know what you are doing a good article for a reader can be done with 50 words of text per item or more. 

A lot depends on what you are selling.

My opinion is that while 100 words of text may be something that we want to use for a full blown product review, the pages that I write are often showing a category of items or choices for the reader so that they understand the full spectrum of what I am talking about.  In the end, the article is made better by the visuals, and many people want the pictures, not just the text. 

Remember the adage that "pictures are worth 1000 words?"

I also want to point out that for an American audience there are expectations that are quite different in other parts of the world.  So we must decide who our audience is.  Let's face it, Americans are consumerism happy.  We want products, and we want to buy stuff.  We are busy, and we want people to show us how to do something, while pointing us directly to where to go to buy the stuff to do the thing.

If you are looking to expand the text of articles, may I suggest contests for different types of informational articles that do not have sales as their basis to drive more articles like that.  I also think that if established authors put their author link to google on each page it helps google connect the articles from various sites to that author.  To that end, we may want to institute an author bio box at the end of each article.  Or an optional one.

Panda and Penguin have changed the face of the internet, but we do not have to be completely driven by Google.  Maybe there is another way to find the spam and clear it out or keep it from the site.

I've got one more thing to say before I never look at this thread again....

And that's to point out that the internet is fast changing, everybody is looking for instant gratification.

Kids look for video explanations rather than articles.

Many Kindle readers consider 30000 words to be a long book.

Shoppers look at pictures.

For music we use spotify or last fm radio and playlists instead of reading music reviews, or we stumble across music on youtube.

Everything is moving away from text, and the article sites response has been to increase the amount of text on a page.

The short term picture is that they think it will win them a bit more traffic, the long term picture is that less and less people are reading. 

An awesome policy would be to force every article to be accompanied with at least one large (and thus pinnable) image.

Another would be to encourage the embed of videos from Google Video and Vimeo wherever possible, rather than YouTube, because the former result in a video thumbnail for the page rather in the SERPs while YT videos do not.

That's the last thing that I have to say to be honest. The internet is one huge malgamation of dozens of forms of communication, and text is losing market share.

I do love Wizzley.

It is a place where a forum debate can be found and held without it being lost in so many religious and political rants.

It is a place where the reasons for an action are given by the staff.

It is a place where reasoned disagreement is listened to and acted upon.

It is a place where democracy works.

Whether or not 50 words is sufficient, it has worked reasonably well until this point, and has been re-instated. Personally I think that is sensible - until proof positive is obtained that it does not work.

It is a place where both sides of a debate can be aired without anybody reverting to the statement 'That's what the Nazi's would have done'.

There I've said it - end of debate!

I second Chaz's post :) this is the best place in earth 2- er um I mean the internet layer, er um I mean the second consciousnesses of man, oh you get the point...

humagaia: 09/25/2012 - 04:49 AM

---

I do love Wizzley.

It is a place where a forum debate can be found and held without it being lost in so many religious and political rants.

It is a place where the reasons for an action are given by the staff.

It is a place where reasoned disagreement is listened to and acted upon.

It is a place where democracy works.

Whether or not 50 words is sufficient, it has worked reasonably well until this point, and has been re-instated. Personally I think that is sensible - until proof positive is obtained that it does not work.

It is a place where both sides of a debate can be aired without anybody reverting to the statement 'That's what the Nazi's would have done'.

There I've said it - end of debate!

Indeed, Wizzley staff do treat these avatars and usernames like the human being that they are behind the screen. In the process they are seen as human beings themselves, and that has created an extremely pleasant environment.